"No scope for things to be worse than in Hasina's time"

Badruddin UmarProthom Alo file photo

We climb the stairs to the first floor, enter the drawing room and find the young man of over 90 years waiting for us on the sofa. He greets us with a smile, asks after our well-being and settles back with his books, notebook, pen, all set our and ready. This is Badruddin Umar.

The three of us had gone to meet him -- Prothom Alo editor Matiur Rahman, writer and researcher Mohiuddin Ahmad and myself. We were there to formally hand over a copy of the book published by Prothoma -- Mohiuddin Ahmad's "Bampanthar Surathal: Badruddin Umarer Itihash Parikroma".

Before we begin our conversation, he hands over the latest copy of Sangskriti, the journal he has been bringing out for 50 years. That's something rare in Bangladesh.

I ask, "How are you doing?" He replied, "I'm getting on in years. No one my age is living anymore. I use to have so many friends. Salahuddin bhai (historian Salahuddin Ahmad), Musharraf Hossain (economist), Siddiqui shaheb (Zillur Rahman Siddiqui) -- none of them are alive." He is 93 years old.

I ask, so how is the country faring?

Umar bhai replies, it is really astonishing, after the fall of a government, how the leaders and activists of the ruling party from the very top down to the grassroots, their loyal police and government officials, fled from their homes in such an unprecedented manner. This itself proves just how much Sheikh Hasina oppressed the people. She fled in fear of public fury.

Why did this happen?

Umer bhai replies, "She imagined this country was her father's property. She named all institutions after herself or members of her family. The other day I saw the names of eight hospitals had been changed. All of them had been named after her family members. She named hundreds and hundreds of institutions similarly in her own family name. Hospitals, universities, bridges, cantonments, nothing was left out. Then there was, of course, the looting, corruption and suppression and repression of the opposition parties.

I ask, how is Yunus saheb running the country now?

He says, the country is riddled with so many problems, it is extremely difficult to manage. There are a hundred types of problems afflicting the country. It is not the responsibility of this government to resolve all the problems. Simply put, if they would lay down exactly what tasks they will carry out, then it would be clear to the people. For example, whatever is needed to be done to hold the election. Let the government do whatever is in its scope. In an interview with the daily Banik Barta, Yunus saheb said, if the political parties do not want reforms, I will hold the election right now. That sounded like a threat. The government has to say, we will do this. We will stay for this number of days. But they is not saying so.

How long do you think this government should stay?

Badruddin Umar replies: "In an interview with Al-Jazeera, Dr Yunus said, there was a proposal for the term of an elected government to be four years. The interim government will remain for less than that. When this was met with criticism, his office came up with a clarification that 'he hadn't said they would stay for four years.' But the manner in which the chief advisor had spoken those words, perhaps implied that was his wish. I feel the interim government won't remain for four years. It will be a lot if they stay for just one year. BNP is putting on the pressure for the election. They are on the threshold of power. Unless the election is held, how will they enter? On the other hand, Jamaat is saying that there is no need for elections now. The party was in a pitiful state during the Awami League rule. I doubt if it will fare much better in the future. Jamaat feels that they will get more seats if the election is held after two years. It is hard to say what turn the situation will take under such topsy-turvy circumstances."

When February would arrive, Hasina would complain that I demeaned her father’s role in the language movement. But it is not my duty to exalt or demean anyone

Editor Matiur Rahman joins in, asking, why does Bangladesh face such disorderly circumstances again and again?

Umar bhai replies rather impassively, the people of this country, particularly the intellectual class, have less intellect. They have more passion and emotion. He quoted a teacher of his university as saying, "The French could have occupied the country rather than the British. The passion and emotions of the people here are similar to that of the French. The people are excessively emotional and passionate."

In this context, Umar bhai refers to an incident regarding his father Abul Hashim, secretary of undivided Bengal's Muslim League. While talking to a Muslim League leader of the Barishal region, Hashim saheb asked, "Why do you all change your minds so frequently?" In reply the leader said, "We live in a land of river erosion. How do we stay in one place for long?"

Umar bhai ruminates, it's hard to tell how far the strong emotions of the people here are racial or how far these are geographical.

Our next question is, what do you think about the student mass uprising that has taken place? Umar bhai says, there’s no such thing as an uprising in South Asia or other countries of the sub-continent. No one in India thinks of an uprising. Not even in Pakistan. That is because there several different races live there. Here almost everyone is of the same race (other than some ethnic communities of the hills and plain land). In India there are ten different kinds of languages and races. The homogeneity we have here does not exist anywhere else.

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Another thing is that the political parties here cannot carry out their responsibilities properly. That is why there are repeated mass uprisings. This time the uprising was the biggest because the repression on the people was extreme. No political party was being able to protest. It was successful because of the student’s movement. The present disorderly state of affairs is only natural. The ruling party has been completely destroyed.

What was the role of the intellectuals?

Umar bhai’s blunt reply, the role of the intellectuals was disgraceful. Most of them supported Awami League and Sheikh Hasina. Sheikh Hasina had given everyone a share. The intellectuals were given all sorts of facilities and benefits too. Quite some time back when an intellectual was asked to sign a joint statement, he said, “Don’t you dare give my name.” Yet he displays a different image in public. That is why the pro-Awami League intellectuals are now in hiding.

Next comes our last question, do you foresee anything good ahead?

Umar bhai replies, “There’s no scope for things to be worse than in Hasina's time. There is the question as to how far the present government will be able to manage things. Then there is the matter of the business establishments. These all belonged to the ruling coterie. They constituted about 80 per cent of the last parliament. The political people of the last regime are not here, the economic people are.”

He adds, people do not analyse class here. If anyone does, he is seen to be a communist. The business class that was in power, will remain in power even if BNP comes. How can the country run well? Workers are fighting for their dues, not for any extra benefits. Does this happen in any other country? There has been no change.

Why are there so many divisions in Bangladesh despite the country being so homogenous? Umar bhai comments on the leftists: There are rifts among the leftists here, but they are still trying to remain united. After independence, a section of the leftists joined hands with Sheikh Mujibur Rahman. Many leftists are even lamenting over Sheikh Mujib’s house being set on fire. They say this was not right. Okay, it was not right. But the question is, why did the common people express such anger against Sheikh Hasina and Sheikh Mujib? Hasina is responsible for this. Sheikh Mujib had an image. Sheikh Hasina exploited that. When February would arrive, Hasina would complain that I demeaned her father’s role in the language movement. But it is not my duty to exalt or demean anyone.

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Matiur Rahman asks about Umar bhai’s house. He says, “The house in Wari was a government one. If we would have asked, Ayub Khan would have allotted it to us, but our father (Abul Hashim) did not do so. We were struggling financially. During Ziaur Rahman’s rule, our possessions were flung out of the house. I was underground at the time. My relative Maj Gen (retd) Golam Dastagir appealed, but to no avail. Perhaps Zia hadn’t even heard of my father.”

Umar bhai’s paternal home was originally on Bardhaman, West Bengal. He came over at a young age, but those memories are still alive.

I ask, when did you go to Bardhaman last? He replied, “In January 2020. I would go there regularly. I am drawn to the place. I was 18 when I came here. I had many friends there. There’s no one left now. I had relatives. My relatives there did well. They became speakers, ministers, members of parliament. No one could do anything here.

In the past there had been must writing in West Bengal about Umar’s work, but not much here. His hurt seems justified. As we left, Umar bhai’s last words were, “ I have lived the life that I wanted to live.”     

* Sohrab Hassan is joint editor at Prothom Alo.

* This conversation appeared in the online edition of Prothom Alo and has been rewritten for the English edition by Ayesha Kabir.