We are 'dalals' of Bangladesh, not of any other country
Rana Dasgupta is a lawyer and Bangladesh Hindu Buddhist Christian Oikya Parishad’s general secretary. After the fall of Awami League government on 5 August amid the uprising of students and masses, chaos broke out across the country. Attacks on the minorities also took place. There are also exaggerations over the attacks on the minorities. Under the prevailing circumstances, Rana Dasgupta talked about the security of religious and ethnic minorities. Sohrab Hassan has taken the interview.
After the fall of the Awami League government on 5 August in the face of te students' mass uprising, you provided information on attacks on the religious and ethnic minorities, but those don't tally with the information in the newspapers. Much of your information lacks evidence.
Ranadas Gupta: We also hoped a good environment free of fear would return. But minorities in at least five districts came under attack on 4 August, the day before the fall of the government. After Sheikh Hasina's resignation as prime minister on 5 August, minorities were attacked in 39 districts. In the wake of an abnormal situation, news poured in over telephone from various districts. There was no scope to verify the information. Some information may be wrong.
Later we came to know about attacks on the houses, business establishments and places of worship of the minorities from various newspapers including Prothom Alo. Looting also took place. Even poultry and livestock have been looted.
Our primary information is that over 200 attacks took place in 50 districts. We are still collecting information. We revealed the entire picture through a press conference on 23 August. And these incidents of attacks should not be considered mere statistics. If an attack is carried out on a house, people of 10 houses panic.
Are attacks on minorities taking place now?
Ranadas Gupta: If you are talking about the attacks on the houses and places of worship of the minorities, that is not happening now. But threats are being made. The most concerning matter is that pressure is being created to remove principals and headteachers of different educational institutions from the minority community. Is this not repression on the minority?
Many said these are not communal attacks. Attacks have been carried out both on the majorities and minorities due to political reasons. Why are you calling these communal?
Ranadas Gupta: Observing the nature of student-masses uprising, we centrally formed a monitoring committee on 3 August. We provided information between 5 August and 9 August to the media outlets. But the nature of those incidents was not political.
Some of the minorities may be involved in politics of Awami League. What will you say when the people not involved in politics come under attack? I want to thank Prothom Alo for publishing the incidents in detail.
In the past we noticed that minorities became the target of attacks before and after an election or in any kind of political change. These are nothing but communal attacks. If these are not communal attacks, why the house of late film director Ritwik Ghatak in Rajshahi was destroyed on 6 August. He was not a leader of Awami League. Although he made films on Bangladesh, he never came to Bangladesh. His house came under attack as he is Hindu.
Another reason is that signs of reputed persons of Bangalees are erased through the attack on his house. After arrival at the airport, the chief of the interim government, Muhammad Yunus, acknowledged the incidents of attacks on the minorities.
The chief adviser visited Dhakeshwari Temple and held a meeting with you. He said there that attacks will not be carried out on the minorities if the rule of law is established. We will be members of a family. Have you been assured of his words?
Ranadas Gupta: We want to maintain this confidence. Four members of the minority community were killed for joining the Student Movement Against Discrimination. So how will you say that the minorities didn't participate in this movement? You have noticed that thousands of youth from the hills staged a protest for creating obstacles to drawing graffiti in Chattogram.
The incidents of attacks decreased after the statements of chief adviser and former home adviser brigadier (Retd) Sakhawat Hossain were published in the newspapers.
Now the news of attacks is not coming in. We are noticing his positive mentality. We see this as positive.
How do you view the role of political parties?
Ranadas Gupta: Political parties blame each other after carrying out attacks on the minorities. Some don't want to acknowledge the incidents. It seems many political parties including BNP have tried to understand the problem. If you want to make Bangladesh free from discrimination, you have to call a spade a spade.
All have to work jointly as to how Bangladesh can come out from discriminatory politics. The students have launched a movement against the discrimination. When Ershad declared state religion in 1988, we stood organised against the discrimination. We want to hope that human dignity and social justice will be ensured irrespective of all religions and creeds after the successful movement of the students.
There are allegations that you were with Awami League during its 15-year misrule, you didn't register a protest. So that is also a reason that attacks were carried out on the minorities after the change of power.
Ranadas Gupta: The allegation is not true. We registered to protest against the undemocratic activities of Awami League during its 15-year rule. Incidents of attacks on minorities took place during the rule of Awami League. Incidents of Ramu, Nasirnagar, Gobindaganj and Sathia proved it. We registered to protest when incidents of attacks were carried out on the minorities across the country in connection with the Durga puja festival in Cumilla in 2021. We have to keep in mind that the minorities are not the 'dalals' (brokers or collaborators) of any party or any other country. If they are 'dalals', they are the 'dalals' of Bangladesh.
Gross violation of human rights and repression against opposition parties took place during the reign of Awami League. Why did not your organisation, Oikya Parishad, protest these wrongdoings? ‘
Ranadas Gupta: Look, our organisation is composed of people from different parties. Some of us are involved with Awami League, some with BNP while some are Gono Forum. They protested from their individual stances. Oikya Parishad, as a civic body, was founded against unjust and discrimination. And we worked to this end. We staged human chains to establish the spirit of the Liberation War and democratic rights. The recent student movement also proves that lack of democracy and rule of law prevailed at that moment.
You know that Indian media is exaggerating the attacks on minority people in Bangladesh. They even reported genocide on minority took place in Bangladesh. Instigative remarks were made by Indian police. Can such propaganda destabilize communal harmony inside Bangladesh?
Ranadas Gupta: If majority of Bangladeshis don’t want, propaganda of any other country won’t work to harm communal harmony here. Secondly, I don’t have any idea on what Indian media reported. I haven’t read or watched any Indian media. I have trust in our media.
While we have witnessed attacks on minorities, we also saw majority people guarding their houses and places of worship.
Ranadas Gupta: We praise the initiative. But I also want to raise the question as to why such a situation would arise? Why would I be attacked in the first place? Why would my houses be destroyed? We didn’t fight for this Bangladesh. Attacks were not carried out on Hindus only, Buddhists and Christians were attacked too. People of ethnic minorities in hills and plains were attacked too. Intimidation is still going on. Hindu teachers are being obstructed to join different educational institutions. The minorities are feeling insecure. This cannot be solved by just guarding. Rule of law must be ensured.
There is an allegation that minorities always take side of Awami League and think the other party as adversary
Ranadas Gupta: Minority communities always consider who will protect them. They will be associated with the party which provides them with minimum security. The dream with which Bangladesh became independent in 1971 has not been realised. We could not create a democratic Bangladesh.
It is believed that the minorities get extra benefits in terms of jobs during the tenure of Awami League.
Ranadas Gupta: Minorities did not get any extra benefits. It is said so because they did not get any privileges in the past. It seemed so because of that. When the Awami League government reduced the discrimination in employment, a section of people immediately started campaigning that extra benefits were given (to minorities). In the past there was deprivation and discrimination in all spheres. Minority participation in the armed forces is 1 per cent, in the police department 3 per cent, in other government jobs 4-5 per cent. The percentage might be more or less 10 in educational institutions, that too is not proportional to the total population.
But Muslims account for around 14 per cent in India. What is the state of the minority in terms of jobs there?
Ranadas Gupta: Jobs are based on education. The Muslims there are inclined to send their children to madrasas. Those who study at madrasa leg behind in competition with the mainstream students. Another thing is India even got presidents from minority communities. Army chief and chief justice were appointed from minority communities. We had a chief justice here, Justice SK Sinha. Speaking as a lawyer, the way he was removed from the post was in contradiction to the Masdar Hossain case (The case concerned the separation of powers in Bangladesh). He tried to safeguard the independence of the judiciary. Although not from the organisation, as a lawyer I protested the decision of his removal. Many others also protested.
Chief adviser urged all to forget the difference between majority and minority and live as a family.
Ranadas Gupta: Bangladesh got independence from this concept of one family. The state belongs to all irrespective of religion. In that case, the difference based on religion in our constitution should be removed. We placed an 8-point demand to get rid of division and discrimination and build a Bangladesh of justice and equality. We demanded a minority commission and minority ministry. A separate law should be made for the protection of minorities. The Chittagong Hill Tracts Agreement should be implemented and the ethnic minorities of the plains should be protected. In order to establish a state free from discrimination, the scriptures of all religions must be recited in state ceremonies.
* The interview, originally published in Prothom Alo print and online editions, has been translated by Rabiul Islam and Galib Ashraf.